Sozdar Avesta, Member of the Presidential Council of the KCK (Kurdistan Communities Union), spoke to Stêrk Tv, assessing the current status of the Peace and Democratic Society Process in Turkey and showing how to interpret the recent meeting with Kurdish people’s leader Abdullah Öcalan, which took place after a break of more than a month. Avesta also speaks extensively about the situation in Şengal (Sinjar) and addresses the Yazidis who still live in camps in South Kurdistan today.
The second part of the in-depth interview, the first part of which can be found here, is as follows:
In his message, Kurdish people’s leader Abdullah Öcalan talks about democratic society, peace, and integration. How do you assess this based on these approaches? How do you assess this message?
The commission must focus on these issues. What does each of these key terms mean? Without internal peace, without everyone being able to live freely in their mother tongue and with their ideas, a democratic society cannot be formed. For a democratic society to be formed, for democratic integration with the state to develop, the corresponding laws are necessary. This is nothing that cannot be achieved with mere rhetoric. The commission’s task is to draft laws. The commission’s first law should be to guarantee the physical freedom of Leader Öcalan, who is the architect of this project. Laws should be enacted on the basis of which the Kurdish issue will be resolved. But this commission has not even prepared a law so that a mother can speak her mother tongue. The people, the democratic forces, need to see this. Courageous steps must be taken, courageous language must be used, and courageous efforts must be made. A cowardly approach is wrong. They have been waging war for 40 years with this mentality, but they have achieved nothing. As Leader Öcalan says, it is our goal to put an end to this great suffering. We have participated in this process with all sincerity. But no one should think that this will go on forever. That is why I want to emphasize this: The commission must, above all, take upon its duties, not be influenced by a ruling party, and act in the interests of society and the hopes that have been created.
The former parliament speakers held a speech, saying that the Right to Hope must be implemented immediately. Of course, they say this after leaving office, not while in office, but it is still important. The commission must be bolder; since it has taken on such a burden, it must fulfill its duties. If it does so, it can sustain this process. But if they cannot, this process will not continue like this. As the Freedom Movement, we will not allow anyone to undermine this process. We know these things very well. We have experience; we have been struggling for 50 years under the leadership of Öcalan. For example, Leader Öcalan declared a ceasefire on September 1st, 1998. What followed was that, within 40 days, they developed an international conspiracy against Kurdish people’s leader Abdullah Öcalan. If Leader Öcalan had turned to the mountains instead of Europe for the sake of peace and to prevent further suffering, who knows where the war would have led? Leader Öcalan turned his attention to Europe so that the problem could be resolved democratically and peacefully. But they developed the international conspiracy. A unilateral sacrifice is never sufficient. Turkish state officials, especially AKP officials, need to see this.
Devlet Bahçeli also needs to stand by his words. He previously said, “A bird cannot fly with one wing.” It is an important statement, but it must be realized in practice. Leader Öcalan’s conditions must be immediately rectified, his Right to Hope must be recognized, and his physical freedom must be ensured. Beyond this, there is nothing that will lead the process to success, and a conclusion will satisfy us or our people.
One of the fundamental aims of this process is the democratization of the Republic. However, massacres against women in the Republic of Turkey, massacres against nature in Kurdistan, and racism against the Kurdish people are increasing day by day. What role and mission should the democratic forces and women’s movements play in the struggle against these massacres and in the establishment of a democratic Republic?
To begin with, one must examine the source of these massacres. The Kurdish issue lies at the heart of the Republic’s undemocratic nature. The failure to correctly define the Kurdish issue in Turkey, to name it, and to develop a solution has burdened Turkey and remained a hump on its back. The state has presented the Kurdish issue as the exact opposite of what it is and has outsourced the matter to external powers in order to bury it through methods and measures under the guise of ‘security measures.’ They have been doing this for decades. There is no gang they have not collaborated with for this. They have developed all kinds of undemocratic practices in Kurdistan and Turkey so that they can suppress the Kurdish issue with violence and genocide.
In this process, the state, the government, has to fight against these undemocratic practices. But it does not do so because it has not yet made a clear decision on how to approach this problem. They still cannot tolerate a mother speaking two words in Kurdish. For example, a family barely escaped being murdered solely because they listened to a Kurdish song in public. In Colemêrg (tr. Hakkari), a child was beaten to death in a public space after accidentally hitting an officer in a bicycle accident. Seasonal Kurdish workers are attacked for speaking Kurdish when they go to work in Turkey. If they dare to silence mothers in parliament, it indicates how widespread racism is. There is the saying that the fish stinks from the head. There is widespread racism against our people. They sent the bodies of our martyred comrades to their families in a disrespectful and immoral manner. There are still bodies of martyrs that they have not handed over to their families. For example, in Lice, they want to destroy the graves of the children of the Önkol family, the martyrs. In the past, dozens of martyrs’ graves were bombed by warplanes and destroyed. All of this has created a lack of trust among the Kurdish people towards the state and such a mentality. That is why we say that steps must be taken in this process initiated by Leader Öcalan. But when they cut off the mothers’ speeches, the racists also take courage from this. Everyone must know what their responsibility is and act accordingly.
Then again, women are subjected to extreme violence and are forced to migrate, not only in Turkey but specifically in the region. In Northern Kurdistan, in Turkey, young people are being forced to migrate en masse. This is part of their special warfare. They are committing massacres so that women will not unite. In particular, violence against women is increasing day by day. The same is happening in Palestine, Afghanistan, and other countries.
As I said at the beginning, this process initiated by Leader Öcalan is creating hope among women. These massacres against women will only end when there is democracy, equality, and freedom. In this sense, the struggle led by women, especially in Kurdistan, is very important. When this process began, Leader Öcalan said that women are the pioneers and subjects of this process. Women need a democratic society and peace more than anyone else. A democratic mindset can only be created by expanding the women’s struggle. The male-dominated mindset can only be eliminated through the women’s struggle.
The nature of Kurdistan is being plundered. The mountains of Kurdistan are bombed dozens of times a day, dams are being built, trees are being cut down, and forests are being burned. A feminicide is being carried out against women and an ecocide against nature in Kurdistan and Turkey. If this process is not successful, these massacres will increase. I call on all women, young people, all those who defend nature, and all their organizations: stand up for your rights; stand up for your values by expanding your struggle. And this struggle must be developed under the leadership of women. It is the women who suffer the most. Young women, in particular, are subjected to brutal attacks. That is why the youth must take responsibility for this process more than anyone else and defend their values.
On one side, there is the democratization of Turkey and the process of resolving the Kurdish issue, but at the same time, there are threats by the Turkish state against the Kurdish people living in North and East Syria. In particular, there are threats by Hakan Fidan and Erdoğan against Rojava. There is talk of brotherhood in Northern Kurdistan, but attacks are being carried out against Rojava. How should this contradiction be interpreted?
The issue of North and East Syria is without a doubt important. Especially since the solution may lie in North and East Syria. Right now, the biggest obstacle to solving the problems in Syria is the Turkish state. This must be emphasized. It is because the AKP government wants the interim government in Syria to be completely under its control. In order for the problems in Syria to be resolved, they must withdraw their hands from there. On March 10, 2025, an agreement was reached between the SDF Commander and Jolani. They signed an 8-point agreement. Immediately afterwards, Turkish Foreign Minister Hakan Fidan went to Damascus with his delegation, and just the next day, they signed a provisional constitution. There was nothing about the Kurds in this constitution. They intervened immediately. Lately again, some talks were held between the SDF Commander and Jolani, and once again, Hakan Fidan and Erdoğan immediately reacted to it and made threats. They want the problems to continue in Syria. They are putting pressure not only on the Kurdish people but on all the peoples of North and East Syria who are based on the project of the democratic nation. The peoples of North and East Syria are, of course, continuing their struggle for democracy. They are the ones who constitute Syria. The administration in North and East Syria always strives to develop a democratic life not just for a part of Syria, but for all of Syria. And the peoples living in Syria draw strength from the model developing in North and East Syria. For example, a massacre was carried out against the Druze people in Suwayda. So the Druze people were forced to declare their autonomy. Most recently, the Alawite community formed their own councils. Then there is the Nusayri community. All these communities cannot live with the mono-ideological mindset espoused by the Turkish state. Thousands of Alawite women were abducted, Druze women were abducted, and Nusayri women were massacred. And not only women, but also children were massacred along with them.
Erdoğan wants to create another deadlock in Northern Kurdistan and Turkey, using the issue of North and East Syria as a pretext. The mentality of the Turkish state and Turkish officials is evident. The problems in North and East Syria concern all of Syria. First and foremost, the Turkish state must withdraw from the areas it occupied there. It must leave the problems of the Syrian people to them, to the Syrian interim government. They can understand each other with North and East Syria. They can resolve their problems through dialogue. And the solution, of course, lies in creating a democratic society, in democratizing the Democratic Syrian Republic. If there is no democratic republic in Syria, the problems cannot be solved. The North and East Syria region is currently the most peaceful region; there is a democratic understanding there, and they govern themselves. They live according to the will of women, the will of youth, and the will of all peoples.
There have been some talks recently. We do not view them negatively. Syrian officials say that everything except secession can be discussed. The Kurds, the peoples of North and East Syria, have never had the intention of dividing Syrian territory or establishing another state on this land. There is no such approach. This means that if certain parties withdraw their influence, the Syrian government and the North and East administration can reach an agreement. And the best solution for Syria is for all peoples to live together equally and freely. Women’s rights must be enshrined in the constitution; women must organize themselves according to their own will, participate in all institutions, engage in politics, and fight for their rights, and the will of all peoples must be recognized. Problems can only be solved with this understanding. But if they insist on imposing their own approach, the authorities in North and East Syria are preparing accordingly and will defend the rights of the peoples. They have been attacked dozens of times so far, and provocations are taking place. There were provocations at the Tishreen Dam, to name an example. Again, some institutions are under attack.
The Turkish Foreign Minister acts as if he were the Foreign Minister of Damascus. He is the same one who said a couple of years ago that they are ready to fire a few missiles from Syria to Turkey, start a war, and enter Syria on this pretext. They start wars when they want. They have to stop creating chaos in Syria. The process in Northern Kurdistan and Turkey is different from the process in North and East Syria. North and East Syria will resolve their issues with the Syrian government; Southern Kurdistan will resolve theirs with Iraq, and Eastern Kurdistan with Iran. The mentality of not solving their own problems and intervening in the problems around them is monolithic and hegemonic. They want to impose their own reality on everyone else. No one accepts this. As far as we can tell, the administration of North and East Syria is prepared against this mentality and will not allow an external power to intervene.
Another important issue is the situation in Şengal (Sinjar). From the very beginning of the process, Kurdish people’s leader Abdullah Öcalan has sent messages to the Êzidî (Yazidi) community, encouraging them to achieve their renaissance and free themselves from the genocidal mentality. The Êzidî community wants to strengthen itself on this basis and achieve its renaissance. However, the games against the Êzidî people are not over. The Êzidî community is still subject to attacks. How should the people of Şengal fight back against these attacks?
Along with the Call for Peace and Democratic Society, Leader Öcalan also defined this process as the renaissance of the Êzidî community. In response to his message, two conferences were held in Şengal. First of all, I salute those who participated in this conference and those who contributed to it. I also respectfully salute our people of Şengal, who have been resisting and struggling uninterruptedly for 11 years. As the Freedom Movement, the Êzidî community has a special place both for us and for all the people of Kurdistan. From the beginning of the process, Leader Öcalan has made assessments regarding our Êzidî community in all his meetings. He sees the struggle of our Êzidî community as very historical and strategic. This community must be kept alive; they must keep themselves alive. This community has continued its struggle against all attacks and decrees for thousands of years and has survived to this day. However, if it does not take precautions now, it faces extinction. Because they were unorganized and defenseless, had migrated extensively, and due to the decrees, were confined to a very narrow area and left out of the processes. All of this posed a threat to our community.
Since the Ferman (genocide) of August 3, 2014, under the leadership of the Freedom Movement and based on the philosophy and paradigm of Leader Öcalan, our people in Şengal and Êzidxan (Yazidi land) have not only been physically saved from genocide; they have also been saved from white genocide. Assimilation has also been partially prevented. Kurdish people’s leader Abdullah Öcalan said that the Daesh (ISIS) mentality that wanted to eliminate this society was defeated thanks to the resistance of the Freedom Movement, the heroes of Êzidxan, the women, and the mothers. This is important. But there are still many dangers. In 2020, the government of Southern Kurdistan and the Baghdad government signed the October 9 agreement. The hardliners want to implement this agreement as soon as possible. They want to force this society back under their rule. The struggle so far has certainly prevented dangers, but it has not completely eliminated them. Most recently, the Iraqi Ministry of Migration and Displaced Persons issued a decision stating that those who migrated from Şengal must remain in the camps where they are. This means playing with the demographics of Şengal and Êzidxan.
They are trying to assimilate the Êzidî population, forcing them to stay where they are. They want to enforce the Daesh mentality through laws, which the Freedom Movement fought against at great cost, from heroes like Mam Zekî to our most recent martyrs. This is very dangerous. What does it mean to force them to stay in these camps? They are even forcing people to migrate. If our society wants to reinvent itself in Şengal, in Êzidkhan, if it wants to achieve its renaissance, if it wants to reevaluate itself historically, socially, and organizationally in terms of culture, art, and belief, then a new understanding. Renaissance does not happen only through conferences. It is an important effort, and I salute it, but conferences alone are not enough. They must organize the whole society with the decisions taken at the conference, with the understanding discussed there, and with the proposals that emerge. Society must be re-examined on this basis. The issue of renaissance is not just a matter of one or two days. They need to open academies, they need to open cultural institutions, and they need to conduct historical research. Women must further expand their struggle. All of this forms the framework for organization. That is what Leader Öcalan is talking about. There is an effort; they want to develop certain things, and this is very important, but it must go deeper. Our Êzidî society must achieve enlightenment and strengthen its unity. Because Şengal is under great danger. As long as this doesn’t happen, there are great dangers. They must strengthen their self-defense more than before and focus on it. They enrich all their institutions well and focus on them. All Êzidî abroad and in Êzidkhan must strengthen their unity. They must develop a common understanding. Women and young people, in particular, must play their part in this. They already do to a certain extent, and they are showing some progress in culture and art, but this is not enough for them to organize themselves based on the fundamental roots of this society. Our people must do this work.
However, I would like to also say a few words to those forces that have not withdrawn from Şengal. First of all, both Baghdad and the Kurdistan Regional Government must respect the political will that has emerged in Şengal, in Êzidkhan. Just as before the Ferman, no one will accept their efforts to rule this society. They will be held accountable. If Iraq wants to become democratic, it must first acknowledge the massacre that took place in Şengal and prosecute those who played a role in this massacre. If they had been held accountable, the massacres against the Druze and Alevis would not have happened.
The approach to Şengal and the Êzidî people is a measure of democracy, morality, conscience, and humanity. If they want a free and democratic life, they must first respect this community. They cannot use it for their own interests. Those who are making calculations on Şengal must withdraw their hands from it. There is the small municipality; they go there every day and seize it. They block the road from Xanesor to Şengal with dozens of vehicles. They must give up all of this.
As the Freedom Movement, Kurdish people’s leader Abdullah Öcalan’s approach is, of course, decisive to us. As the Freedom Movement, we have taken a stand against the threats to Şengal, and we will continue to do so. Our Êzidî community has now reached a stage where it governs and defends itself. As the Freedom Movement, we have put in a great deal of effort and sacrificed hundreds of martyrs. We will never allow anyone to attack these achievements.
Our people must have self-confidence. They have this political will, this consciousness, and this power. They can organize themselves based on Leader Öcalan’s ideas. An enlightenment is taking place in our society, but it needs to grow.
I would like to take this opportunity to appeal to our people remaining in those camps: They are playing games on you. You should not fall for them. Do not act according to those decisions in the camps. This is intimidation. If you want to return to your lands, then everyone should do so. No one can stand in your way. No one should remain in the camps in Southern Kurdistan. Everyone should return to their villages and cities. They should continue their lives with the people of the region in a democratic, equal, and ecological manner. The Êzidî people are currently living alongside all the Shiite, Arab, and Assyrian-Syriac peoples in the region, and they are not experiencing any problems. Those who want to create chaos have to withdraw their hands from Şengal. I believe that our people will gradually develop Leader Öcalan’s democratic society perspective and the women’s renaissance and the Êzidî society’s renaissance in Şengal. On this basis, they will achieve great success.