In the third part of this in-depth interview, Mustafa Karasu, member of the KCK Executive Council, spoke about the importance of the Kurdish language, as well as the relations between Turkey and Israel.
The first part of the interview can be read here, and the second here.
Then there were also the Peace Mothers who were prevented from speaking to the commission in their mother language, Kurdish…
Preventing the Peace Mothers from speaking Kurdish in the commission undermines trust of society. What is the purpose of this commission? Isn’t it democratization? Isn’t the most fundamental problem of democratization the resolution of the Kurdish issue? The most fundamental problem of the Kurdish issue is the mother tongue, education in the mother tongue. The president of the Amed Bar Association said, “This is the Kurdish issue.” They ask what the Kurdish issue is; this is the Kurdish issue. They don’t allow mothers to speak Kurdish in parliament.
The most legitimate thing in the world is for a person to speak their own mother language. But they are trying to silence the people. This is the Kurdish question. This is the democratization issue. No other problem can be resolved without resolving this issue. It is a serious situation. It is really difficult to understand Turkey. Could something like this happen anywhere else in the world? Someone speaks Kurdish in parliament and is silenced. And there is no serious reaction to this. The reaction of the DEM Party is insufficient, and the reaction of other opposition forces is also insufficient. Where are you, CHP members? Why didn’t you intervene when this mother was not allowed to speak? Is there anything more legitimate, reasonable, or justified than a woman in a society speaking her own mother tongue? It is like a right to life. But there has been no serious reaction. This shows the state of that parliament, the state of politics in Turkey. The party’s approach is wrong. They need to show a serious reaction. They need to walk out on such an approach. This is the problem with democratization. As the president of the Amed Bar Association said, this is the Kurdish issue. This issue showed the true nature, attitude, and mindset of that commission. It’s unacceptable.
The Kurdish community should have reacted more strongly to this incident. They could have stood up everywhere. What does “Speak Kurdish!” mean? The commission’s stance in this regard is unacceptable and intolerable. It shows the state of Turkey, the state of politics in Turkey. It shows what the Kurds, the community, have been through for a hundred years. It is important to always look at things closely in order to understand how they are. The commission has shown how it is.
Meanwhile, the government media’s rhetorical attacks against northern and eastern Syria continue unabated. While representatives from Damascus are seeking a possible agreement under the March 10 accord, representatives of the Turkish state persistently speak of an operation and an attack on North and East Syria. Many actors are trying to develop a solution, surely all according to their own line with their ideas, to end the war in Syria. Only the Turkish state is vehemently pushing for war. At a time when the discussion about peace and democratization is at the top of the agenda in Turkey itself, the AKP government continues to talk about war. How is this to be understood?
The AKP has brought the war to the agenda. And now Devlet Bahçeli has threatened again. Devlet Bahçeli asked, “Will they listen to Israel or Apo, to Imrali?” Okay, let Imrali be an actor in that regard. How will it be an actor? How will it be an actor while under isolation, with no delegation coming or going? So what he truly said is, “Let it be an actor in Syria”; that’s what it means. Will they listen to the AKP, or will they listen to Israel? Of course, that people will listen to their leader, Abdullah Öcalan. In Rojava, the Kurds in North and East Syria listen to Kurdish people’s leader Abdullah Öcalan. There is no doubt in this. They make this clear in their daily rallies and meetings. They recognize him as their leader, as their guide. Because he worked there for twenty years, it was him who brought that society to that point. So this leader needs to be a player there; he needs to play his role. They say to Kurdish people’s leader Abdullah Öcalan that he can’t interfere here or there, but that he has to play his role for that place. How will he play it? The government needs to take this seriously.
The reason for their threat of war is that they are afraid that the Kurds there will become autonomous and thus set an example. That’s all. That’s their concern. They have to solve their own problem. If they are going to solve their own problem, why are they opposing the people’s decentralized solution, the autonomous solution there? They have to solve their own problem. Their approach is wrong. Then again, they put the Misak-ı Milli on the agenda. What are you talking about? They speak of “their Kurdish brothers.” They even say, “We Kurds and Turks are intertwined, like flesh and nails.” You don’t stand up for the Kurds, but you stand up for some undemocratic, authoritarian thing that’s a derivative of ISIS. What kind of understanding is this? Stand up for the Kurdish people there. Let there be a solution; everyone wants it. But the structure in Damascus right now is not democratic; there are no fair elections, and it’s unclear how they will treat women. How will Kurdish women live there? They will kill all the Kurdish women; they will lynch them. They will call them infidels; they will do who knows what. The situation needs to be solved, but the system has to be democratic. They hold their own elections, they make their own constitution, and they do whatever they want; how will a solution derive from them? Is that how problems are solved? What world are you living in? It wasn’t even like that in the Middle Ages. But fascist mindsets approach it that way.
The situation is problematic. Turkey’s approach is not right. They had softened a little recently, but now they are hardening their approach again. What is there to gain for Turkey if it attacks? They are talking about military power. Okay, but where is your legitimacy? Every day they speak about Israel, saying it is interfering, attacking, and disrupting. Okay, but what are you doing? Are you going to bring stability there? You’re so hostile to the Kurds, and then you dare to say, “The Kurds prefer this.” Why are you attacking the Kurds and pushing them towards another policy? They are guilty and responsible for this problematic situation. They should approach the Kurds positively, establish a relationship. They are talking about Misak-ı Milli and “their brothers,” so they should develop an according policy. They are hostile to the Syrian Kurds, while calling the Kurds in Northern Kurds, in Turkey, “my brothers”. There is no trust in them. Even the Kurds in the AKP don’t believe it; even the Kurds who vote for the AKP don’t accept it. Their approach is wrong and must be abandoned.
Devlet Bahçeli raises the question of whether the Kurds would listen to Imrali. They should establish a corresponding rapprochement and allow Kurdish people’s leader Abdullah Öcalan to be an actor there, to play a role. Because this people is loyal to Kurdish people’s leader Abdullah Öcalan. They are not a people who will listen to anyone other than Kurdish people’s leader Abdullah Öcalan. The Kurds in Syria are foremost in their loyalty to Kurdish people’s leader Abdullah Öcalan. In fact, when he was taken hostage and was brought to the Imrali Island as part of the international conspiracy, he thanked the Kurds of Rojava for embracing him. The problem in Rojava and North and East Syria can be solved with Kurdish people’s leader Abdullah Öcalan’s role. And if the problem is not solved, there will be a crisis and conflict. The Kurds will not be intimidated by threats or anything else. They are ready to fight and resist until the end. What else can they do?
What would such a war bring to Turkey? I think the state needs to show a slightly more reasonable, slightly more correct approach, a slightly more logical, solution-oriented approach. It has to ask itself what the right thing to do is. Attacking by saying, “We will crush you, you will give up, you will give up a decentralized system,” is an unreasonable approach.
Tensions between Turkey and Israel, which are evident in Syria, are growing daily. What is their origin and how far will they develop?
In fact, Turkey played a major role in the establishment of Israel. Without a state like Turkey, Israel would not exist there. Turkey has been the country that has given Israel the most support in the Middle East. This has been the case until recently. And they are still seeking reconciliation with Israel.
The Turkish state has pursued its policy of Kurdish genocide based on its relationship with Israel, with the support of the US and Europe. Without establishing the right relationship with Israel, it could not establish relations with the US and Europe. In this regard, it established relations with Israel to create genocide against the Kurds and received the support of the US and Europe. This is a fact. Now that Turkey has distanced itself somewhat from its historical role, namely that of being Israel’s biggest supporter, Israel has taken a stance against Turkey. Until recently, the two countries had the best relations. Of course, Israel does not want to have these anti-Islamists right next door—one should not call them radical Islamists, and one should not see them as Islamists at all. HTS is not Islamist; they are anti-Islam, and they only abuse Islam. Just as it does not want to have Hezbollah as a threat, it does not want to have HTS as a threat either. When Turkey chose to embrace HTS, tension arose between them. This tension is created by Turkey’s Syria policy. Since Erdoğan supports Daesh and HTS, who call themselves radical Islamists—but are actually anti-Islam; they do not exalt Islam, they destroy it—Israel takes a stance against him.
As long as Turkey does not abandon that policy, it will clash with Israel. And Israel also receives support from the US and Europe. Yes, Europe may be speaking out, but that is because of the massacre in Gaza. What is happening in Gaza is truly unacceptable in the eyes of humanity. Some governments in Europe also do not accept it and are taking a stance, but their main policy is still to back Israel. In this regard, Israel wants to stop Turkey’s policies by taking the US and Europe on its side. Will it escalate further? If Turkey does not change its policies, it could escalate further because Israel has this support behind it, as we can see.
The Kurdish people are eagerly preparing for the 33rd International Kurdish Culture Festival in Dortmund, Germany. What significance does the festival have, especially at this time?
Culture and arts festivals are of great importance. And this particular festival encompasses the whole of Europe. It has been celebrated since 1992. It was not celebrated only one year due to a ban in Germany, but otherwise it has been celebrated without interruption. Different cultural and arts festivals are also held in Switzerland and France. These are very positive developments because the Kurds are a people who have suffered cultural genocide. Cultural and artistic activity is an activity of existence for the Kurds. So it is very important. Kurds have to embrace their culture and art. This should not be populist, individualistic art; it should be communal art, art that considers the Kurdish community and defends its existence. Art cannot be individualistic; culture cannot be individualistic. Capitalism has tried to individualize it, but this is a deviation, a distortion. It is a betrayal of culture and art. Culture is for society; art is for society.
As I said, this festival has been going on since 1992. I personally participated in the second festival as a speaker, and I also participated in the third festival. It was very important, and the Kurdish people also attached great importance to it. For the Kurdish people, this festival is part of their lives. It happens every year. Just like waiting for Newroz, our people in Europe wait for this cultural festival. In this sense, it is necessary for our people in Europe, especially young people and women, to participate in the festival. Culture is somewhat the domain of women; it is a reality shaped around women. Young people keep culture alive. In this regard, I call on all Kurds, especially young people and women, from every corner of Europe to come to Dortmund. On this basis, I already celebrate our people’s cultural festival in Europe and wish them success.